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Yeah, it's the economy, stupid...

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by mikeky, Nov 15, 2002.

  1. mikeky

    mikeky Member

    ... but what are you going to do about it?!

    By all pundit accounts, the economy is in the toilet. Greenspan lowers interest rates and Bush had his tax cut, but neither seem to be stimulating the economy yet (at least according to those same pundits). So what can the government do to help the economy move along? Forget the war on terrorism to help firm up the markets? Large government contracts to infuse money into the economy? More tax cuts and lower interest rates? Higher minimum wages? Price freezes and wage controls (just kidding, Mr. Nixon)?

    Armchair economist, report in please. Let's fix this thing.
     
  2. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    Just my .02 .... The economy isn't business and investing, it's the consumer. Business and investing are just the benchmarks by which we measure the economy.

    People spending money is the only thing that gets the economy going. The same pundits that are telling us the economy is in for a dry spell are the same ones that would have us believe the economic theories of Lord Keynes are dead, yet everything Greenspan, the great inflation slayer, does is purely Keynesian.

    Keynes postulated that in times of non-inflationary economic distress, the government had at its disposal 2 methods of economic stimulus, both of which involve putting more money in play; printing more money and/or spending more money. Federal interest rate cuts are tantamount to printing more money.

    The real way out of a disheveled economy is for people to buy more goods. QED
     
  3. Misu

    Misu Hey, I saw that.

    Sucks how our government wants to put almost 1 million government jobs into the private sector... Used to be a government job meant security and good pay. Now it means you're going to work in the private sector and get fired and wages go down and benefits go away, etc.

    Jobs like street cleaners, agriculture workers, office persons in government offices like social security, etc - that type of work is going to go private. Just read about it on Yahoo.

    So the government gives out contracts to private companies, which is basically the job goes to the LOWEST bidder, salaries go DOWN... and how is this administration going to help our country out of the econmic rutt it's in? By making it a ton worse for almost 1 million people? Nice thinking....not.
     
  4. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    Ah Misu, that job security you're talking about is the very same thing that makes government so horribly inefficient and expensive. A civil service guy that hangs drywall gets paid, rather handsomely, by the hour. In construction, they get paid by the piece. The more work they do, the more money they make.

    As you are of Uruguaian descent and married to a man of Cuban roots, I hope you will not take umbrage at this example. Here on the left coast, there is much ado about a living wage and people without health care. There is more wailing from one side about illegals and from the other about the poor 'immigrants' that are being taken advantage of by the big business.

    It ain't true. Most illegals out here are employed in the service industries by small businesses that are primarily hispanic owned. Are they working for poverty wages? Yep. Do they have health insurance? Nope.

    Of course the case can and should be made that these small businesses wouldn't be doing this if people and companies wouldn't use their services...and this is correct and the reason that I require any contractor that bids on work for me provide proof upon request that all of his employees are legal. I no longer accept the minimum bid with no questions asked. If everyone did their part, it would be a huge blow to illegal immigration as the jobs simply wouldn't be there....cost us more up front? Sure. Cost us less in having to provide social services to illegals? Absolutely.

    To relate this back to the topic, all of the civil service jobs the government would like to outsource are for these very service jobs...like landscaping and lawnmowing. A huge waste of resources if the guy that cuts the grass is a civil servant. Nice work if you can get it, but a huge waste nonetheless.
     
  5. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer

    Ever since March 2000 when the tech bubble burst, the market has gone downhill.

    Everything goes in cycles.

    I really thought the tax cuts, and a Republican House would cut down on Government spending spurning the Economy.

    I still think Greenspan and the Fed erred in rising the interest rates so quickly prior to the market burst. That contributed to the fall, Each cut takes three to 6 months to affect the economy, and to cut almost every month without waiting for the desired effect seems quite irresponsible to me. But that is water under the bridge...though they are doing the same tactic with the new reductions.

    The terrorist attack of 9/11 has had a profound affect on this economy. The mindset of the American people has changed from the secure we are safe mentality to a cautious almost paranoid apprehension.

    The intro to the world of the www and the technologies that sprang from the wide spread acceptance of this new communication avenue has lost some of it's unique properties, that is, "the stimulation of a new product or service."
    Many people I know, who were so enamored of this phenomenon have gotten bored and seldom spend as much time on the Web as before.

    Even the new XP from Microsoft has failed to re-ignite the past glories.

    I still think that the Economic pundits are really to blame.
    Consumer confidence always follow the protignations of these forecasters.

    Constantly seeing gloom, they create the conditions that ensures continued stagnation.

    I wish they would all get together, dismiss the real facts, and just lie to us all that "Golly Gee the economy is poised to rebound with a vengeance.""Time to get in with Stocks and Investments before you lose out on the profits."

    That is really what is lacking.
    A sign that the economy is on the mend.
    SOMEONE needs to tell the consumers that!
     
  6. mikeky

    mikeky Member

    But what can the administration do to boost consumer confidence?
     
  7. jfcjrus

    jfcjrus Veteran Member

    Hummm,
    I'd love to believe:
    But, if consumers are what's been keeping this economy afloat for the last couple of years, and you consider that;

    ..Millions of highly paid folks (consumers) have been layed off -
    ..Unemployment benifits are running out -
    ..Consumer debt is the highest it's been in decades -

    Wishfull thinking? Somehow these numbers don't seem to add up.
    I just can't help but wonder if the 'consumer' is about tapped out.

    Time will tell, I guess.

    Regards,
     
  8. Sierra Mike

    Sierra Mike The Dude Abides Staff Member

    The consumer is tapped out. Corporate America needs to start buying their way out of this recession. It would mean reduced profits in the short term, but it would galvanize the economy and start us heading for an upswing.

    SM
     
  9. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    Corporate America has already mortgaged its future by the layoffs so as to not miss the dividend by 2 cents. If they were willing to help America they already had a great chance.

    Edit to include the world "not" in the first sentense. Think faster than I type - really sad.
     
  10. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    Shiny has part of the picture I think....the rush to the bottom line. Short sighted and not as necessary as many CEO's believe. That is the one thing that actually shoots consumer confidence right in the foot. The vast majority of folks are still working and not hurting. What they aren't doing is buying or investing. A bit scary to commit to that new car or other high ticket purchase when you're wondering if your job is going to be there this time next year.
     
  11. fritzmp

    fritzmp Fire Fire For Effect

    Give all the Government workers shelter halves and a carbean and send them to the borders to guard them for illegals. I could live with a couple of bad years of economy if it meant trimming the Government pay role by 50%

    Not many water cooler leaning jobs in the real world.

    The best thing the government can do for the economy is nothing. The idea they actually do anything for it is a fallacy. Though they can screw it up and do. The law and the protection of the nation is about the scope of their duty as the founders saw it and is still true today.

    Not keeping to the program.
     
  12. jamming

    jamming Banned

    caribbean??? You want to give them a Sea?
     
  13. fritzmp

    fritzmp Fire Fire For Effect

    damn spell checker.:(
     

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