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What a crime, we don't all agree.

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by -Ken, Nov 12, 2002.

  1. -Ken

    -Ken Guest

    Forgive me, I've been taking a beating this week. To be the
    opposition here can be a hard thing to swallow sometimes.

    To illustrate:
    <small>Shiny said,</small>
    <small>Jedi Writer said,</small>
    <small>Coot said,</small>
    <small>and later Coot said,</small>
    Something to the effect, in a perfect world, I would agree with him (even
    though this seemed to be offered in a humorous spirit).

    So, is this what everybody wants? We all agree? No kidding! We expect
    to find a cessation of hostilities between countries but we can't find
    common ground between those of us who speak the same language
    and love the same country?

    Want homogenous? Try milk.
    I should have to agree because everybody else agrees? Huh? Because
    someone else thinks they have written an ironclad rationale for
    their position, I should completely reform my view of life?
    My, what big opinions of ourselves we carry.

    Let's get a few things said here:

    I believe the overwhelming majority of people wish to be left alone to live
    their lives the way they choose.

    I believe the overwhelming majority of people will respond nicely when
    treated with respect and kindness.

    I believe people are uniform in this and we can find examples of this
    universally throughout the world.

    I believe when you pick a fight, you get a fight, what the hell did you
    expect you would get?

    I also believe there is a need for diversity in opinion. For someone to
    pretend their opinion is the perfect truth borders on delusional, even
    if it is my truth.

    As much as you all may think I don't listen, I do. Because I choose to hold
    a different opinion than the majority means nothing more than I have a
    different opinion.

    Unless you can get God to come and post here in your defense, your
    opinion is no more valid than anyone else's, including mine.

    I don't live in any more of a fantasy world than any of the rest of you
    from what I can tell.

    We all create the reality we view the world from. If you believe Blacks are
    lazy, shiftless, genetically prone to crime, I'm sure you will find compelling
    reasons to reassure yourself.

    But to put forth the proposition that you are the one correct truth is an
    affront to both God and people like me who know they are right (just
    kidding here).

    You want to discuss? I'm all for it. You think I should agree with you?
    Damn, that's funny, I think you should agree with me.

    Personally, I think the problem is I'm getting under your skin because
    somewhere deep inside of you I've dented that armor we all carry. You
    know, that armor which protects the views we understand the world with.
    If that's the case, I'm not sorry. Maybe your views need examination.

    I can make no apologies for lies you have told yourself, you need to
    apologize to yourself for that.

    There you go, bash away. I guess I haven't had enough yet.
  2. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    Who got a dent in their armor?
  3. tke711

    tke711 Oink Oink Staff Member


    While you and I have disagreed both here and at DSLR many times in the past, I have always enjoyed the discussion. I have also enjoyed seeing the "other side" of the issue in order to further form my own opinion. At times, my opinion has been modified, and at times, my opinion has been further resolved.

    IMHO, that is what is so great about this place. We are all able to post our opinion on a given topic and have a great debate from there. We may not always agree. In fact, some of us may never agree. Such is life. And wouldn't life be boring if all thought the exact same thing?

    So, keep being true to yourself Ken and we'll all continue the good spirited discussions over the virtual campfire called "Global Affairs". I for one enjoy the hell out of it. :)

    BTW, if I'm ever up in your neck of the woods, the beers are on me. :beer:
  4. jfcjrus

    jfcjrus Veteran Member

    Yea, no shit, I've read the posts.
    But, I'll tell you something Ken, I, for one, sincerely hope that you'll keep posting your beliefs on the various subjects.

    I can't say that I totally agree with you many times, but, once in a while, you do prompt me to pause and evaluate my position.
    And that is not a bad thing.

    I'm sure you don't expect to change my opinion overnight. You post good arguments, abet a little strong at times. But, I do filter what you say into what my life experience has taught me, to see if some variance is in order.

    Yea, it's tough, and you're delusional.
    But, I urge you to keep it up.
    You provide a nice balance to the debates.
  5. jamming

    jamming Banned

    Ken, we don't always agree but one thing we do agree on is the need for diverse opinions. (or is the de worst opinion) ;) I understand your points and I believe you understand mine. I have found that you are easier to take when I realized that I don't have to change your mind. I sometimes think that you believe that you have to change my mind.

    However, you do once and awhile appear to be insulting to others beliefs and you should be aware of it, though I grant you my willingness to believe that you are ignorant in doing that rather than malicious. Just want you to be aware that, it is as important to present your case in a way that minimizes the disaffection of your target audience if you want them to understand and just not read your words.
  6. Misu

    Misu Hey, I saw that.

    Keep giving them hell, Ken. Without people like us, there'd be no point to reading and participating in these threads ;)
  7. Omar

    Omar Registered User

    I, for one, would like to thank you for providing this forum a balance that is mostly needed. Unfortunately, I can not log in from home most of the time unless I travel.

    It's good to see you provide a great post after the next.
  8. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer



    Glad to see all the encouragement. See, you are not as alone as you somehow see yourself.

    The following is not directly directed to anyone in particular.
    More of an introspective soliloquy to myself...

    We all take things personally.
    I am guilty of it also.
    I took umbrage at what I thought was an attack and lashed out in the Fonda thread.
    I was instantly put down in a condescending way which elicited an even stronger reply in response.

    I tried to count to ten, but even counting to a thousand only re-created and embellished my anger. Our first reaction when we are attacked is to lash out violently. This initial action, while temporarily relieving the built up stress, has an equal stress built in it. The escalation is personal to both parties involved. Our fear is that others will judge us and label us in so many undeserving terms. We become what we fear most: A label.

    Why are we told to never talk about religion and politics?

    Because both subjects are ruled by beliefs and beliefs are emotions attached to words.
    Think about it...
    Emotions over-ruling the mind.

    We will use every rationale we can to reinforce these beliefs ergo emotions.

    This is why I have lurked and learned but rarely participated in many of these political threads.

    The Fonda thread was Not an attempt by myself to finally get involved. The mentioned hippie flippant remark that pulled me in was meant in jest.

    When it was taken seriously, and twisted in an attempt to prove how callous and mis-informed a particular side (conservative) was in relation to the other side, (liberal) I attacked with emotion.

    I have since taken a deep breath...
    and I have felt shame.

    But I have also learned from that experience and that is to not take myself so seriously... nor an opposing opinion as a personal assault.

    ...at least I hope I have learned that...;)
  9. -Ken

    -Ken Guest


    The expression "When the student is
    ready, the teacher will make themself
    known." weighs in on me at this moment.

    It is a wonderful feeling to have so
    many great teachers. I am deeply
  10. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer


    The teacher is within all of us.

    Listen to the still small voice inside.

    Past the material attachments, past the ego, past the heart, past the I.
  11. God

    God Registered User

    Ummm Ken,

    Yea WAPU is right. Listen to everything he says. His opinion is the most valid here. Thank you for listening.

  12. Jedi Writer

    Jedi Writer Guest

    The very small portion of my post quoted above is meaningless and explains nothing as you quote it in such a narrow context.

    Also, my post that you extract the quote from was not writtern in response to anything you posted. My post was written overall as a new genereal post and part of it was written in response to someone else's post--not yours. So you will have to strike it as well as my name from your lets beat up on Ken list.
  13. ditch

    ditch Downunder Member

    Ken, God has turned up believe it or not. I haven't had an audience yet and I see the queue is long already. Its unfotunate that at times you carry the load of insult and beatings on your own but it appears the shoulders are broad. Ignore emotional and ignorant insults. Its only the intelligent, rational and sensible barbs that can sting.
  14. Sierra Mike

    Sierra Mike The Dude Abides Staff Member


    For my money, you have two approaches:

    1.) Do try to be more precise in your posts. You lead folks such as myself in one direction, then reverse yourself and say, "Oh, I didn't mean that!"

    2.) Stop crying about it. I can't believe you even started this thread. Take it on the chin, lad. Some people here aren't going to agree with you, myself included. Get over it and move on.

  15. -Ken

    -Ken Guest


    Both very good criticisms.

    With regards to being focused, believe it or not I do try.
    Maybe it doesn't readily show up in my posts but each
    one is reread several times before it gets posted.

    At any given juncture, there are sentences, which I cannot
    see the double meaning to. Since I authored the statement,
    I read it back and understand the intention because that is
    how I wrote it.

    Regarding the statement about crying, this makes
    a great example. My intention was not to sound like I
    was crying but rather to understand what the "outside
    looking in" was seeing.

    Upon rereading the opening post, I can see how it
    could be interpreted that way. I will try to take into
    account all possible meanings when I write but I
    believe it will never be 100%.

    I guess that will mean I will have to do continuous
    backpedaling or maybe those of you who know me,
    will understand, I very rarely attack unless I really
    feel it is warranted.

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