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Teachers harming students in contract negotiations

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by tke711, Nov 22, 2002.

  1. tke711

    tke711 Oink Oink Staff Member

    Stories like this one are unfortunately becoming more and more frequent. Why is it that the teachers union feels that it is OK to harm students in an effort to gain leverage during contract negotiations? How is this really anything but extortion or old fashion mafia behavior?

    "Well....see....we either get a better contract....see....or we hurt the future of your kids....see."

    Does the teachers union really think that this type of behavior is deemed acceptable by the vary people who's property tax is paying their salary?

    Oh, and what exactly is the teachers union fighting for in this district? Here is what they have been offered so far, but I guess that it just isn't enough:

    The School Board in Brown Deer has offered the union a 4.9% raise in the first year and 5.1% in the second year of their contract.

    Under the boards proposal, the average pay for teachers would be $54,124. The highest paid teacher would make $63,797. On top of that, the board is proposing a generous package of fringe benefits. For 2002-2003 the average value of benefits would be $21,677 bringing the average total average compensation to $75,801.
     
  2. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    No offense to teachers in here, but these salaries are way over the top.

    I don't see them trying to improve the QUALITY of the teachers just the quality of their salaries.
     
  3. Violet1966

    Violet1966 Stand and Deliver Staff Member

    I know too well how this stuff goes down too. My father was a teacher for over 30 years. His pay was not as high as those figures though and he would not join the union.

    When it was time to negotiate, the teachers in his school would threaten to strike. One year they did and my father had the tough choice of staying home to keep his friends, and keep me home because I was going to the same school. Well he went against his union friends and went to work. He also sent me to school. I was going to the same school he taught in. (yeah it was loads of fun. LOL)

    Well the whole school was going to hell and the kids were suffering for it. I know I was suffering too because my father was coming home every day very upset but could not put his own problems with money, ahead of those he vowed to help through their schooling.

    For that we both suffered. My father was called a scab and even was verbally abused for sending me to school.

    I hope that one day people realize that the kids are the most important thing in this all, not the money. I think back and it still hurts :(
     
  4. Misu

    Misu Hey, I saw that.

    Call me crazy, but aren't school boards usually made up of former teachers?

    And withholding rec. letters is totally unprofessional. How do they expect to get taken seriously when they're using extortionary tactics?
     
  5. RRedline

    RRedline Veteran MMember

    I have been known to post long rants about about education, teacher salaries, etc. I'll try to keep this one short, though.

    Before I go any further, I want to state that I know there are many, many teachers in this country who are not paid nearly what they are worth, particularly in southern states and California.

    However, in general, I think teacher salaries and benefits are very good. I could understand teachers speaking out in large numbers and the union fighting for huge salary increases it it was twenty years ago! Back then, teachers were severely underpaid.

    When I hear a teacher demanding that they be paid as much as a lawyer or a doctor, I immediately lose respect for them. Yes, we know your job is very important to society. But guess what? SO IS MINE! So is my neighbor's. So is my mother's. What's your f-ing point? Why do you deserve better than the rest of us? Oh, you have a four year degree? Well join the f-ing club. If you don't like earning a "measley" $50,000 per year, then why did you go to school to be a teacher? You love helping kids? Blah blah blah...whatever. I like playing with myself all day long, but the pay isn't nearly as much as I make with my current employer. Instead of sitting at home playing with myself all day complaining about the lack of salary and benefits, I go to work at an actual job. I have no union to demand money for me. If I strike, I don't get a paycheck, and my employer doesn't negotiate. I'd be fired. See ya later...don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out. And good luck fighting it in court. I'd have lost the case before even making it to trial.

    If you want to make the same amount of money that a lawyer or a doctor makes, go to school to be a doctor or a lawyer. I guarantee that once you're finished with your degree(s) and start your new job, you'll understand why people like me throw up when we hear teachers bitching like a bunch of eighth graders who don't want to do their science projects.
     
  6. RRedline

    RRedline Veteran MMember

    I can't speak for the rest of the country, Misu, but I have never known school boards to comprise mostly of former teachers. People with education backgrounds are usually a small minority when it comes to school board members. Perhaps that's why boards so often clash with teachers and administrators.
     
  7. Violet1966

    Violet1966 Stand and Deliver Staff Member

    I have to say the same as RR on this one. In my dad's school, there were no former teachers on the board. had their been, there might have been quite a few less problems.
     
  8. Misu

    Misu Hey, I saw that.

    Silly me, assuming a school board would be made up of teachers, who actually know what's needed in the school system :nut:
     
  9. EMIG

    EMIG Yup

    School boards are usually elected, and given the apathy of the average American voter...
     
  10. EMIG

    EMIG Yup

    Please don't. The main reason why switched my major from Biology to Chemistry was that I couldn't stand the fucking pre-med majors. Most of them took Bio instead of Chem because it was perceived to be easier. They were boggled by the fact that I actually loved Biology for its own sake, and had no desire to cut up people, living or dead. So I switched to Chemistry where I came to meet Dr. DeFotis and was cast into the Hell that is Quantum Chemistry. But I digress...
     
  11. RRedline

    RRedline Veteran MMember

    I spent my first five semesters as a chemistry major. I switched to secondary education and got my degree and teaching certificate. I am now employed as a programmer. I guess I couldn't make up my mind. :)

    By the way, I did well in chemistry...I just started to dislike it. Organic is extremely interesting but can be extremely difficult as well. That course was a bane to many biology majors.
     
  12. EMIG

    EMIG Yup

    Organic was fun. I was taking it at the same time as I was being annoyed by the doctor wannabes, and it was a large part of my decision to switch.

    I did manage to finish my Chemistry degree eventually, after suffering many more indignities like Radiochemistry and Polymer Science II.

    I am also a programmer now. It was hard to escape the '90s without becoming one. Just ask Dilbert.
     
  13. jamming

    jamming Banned

    I would like to point tke711, sometimes school boards don't negotiate in good faith with the teachers or their unions. If the threat of a strike is kept from occuring because the students would not be educated then the threat is a hollow one. I am not a big fan of education unions, but sometimes there are situations where the School Boards are unreasonable, even withholding cost of living level raises.
     
  14. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    And there are instances of school boards getting hit with unplanned crap, like a student nurse for a child that can never learn but the mother and a lawyer go to court.. Or combating law suits from parents when baby does not pass in spite of missing half a school year. Or hiring lawyers for lawsuits about why copying is not wrong. No, just as in the Health Care thread in the America's forum there are many places to lay the blame.

    The taxpayer is tired of high taxes to support schools out of control, the school board is required to provide better education on less bucks, and the teachers are (I know, not all) going for higher salaries without agreeing to more accountability.

    The cream of the crop of the students will find a way to learn, the loss will be the children who need just the right push, just the right encouragement to start believing that learning is fun. They will be left behind while the school board, teachers, and parents point the finger at each other.
     
  15. jamming

    jamming Banned

    Oh I realize Shiney it goes both ways, I just saying it is hard to know without being familiar with the situation there.
     

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