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PSA 12 Days

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by Coot, Nov 12, 2002.

  1. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    Privately, scientists from the FSU are telling their counterparts in the U.S. that they 'lost control' of their Small Pox program in 1991. The real shocker was that it wasn't a small vial of the stuff tucked away in a secured freezer in Siberia. A Small Pox viral cluster about the size of a match head is all that is required to start an unchecked epidemic. The amount the Former Soviet Union had at the time of its demise was close to 20 tons. The intent was to weaponize it into warheads as Small Pox spreads through the air rather than by contact.

    Jane's reported a few months ago that Iraq, with 100% certainty has it stockpiled, as does North Korea.

    One of the magic numbers with respect to small pox is 12 days. That is the incubation time. On the 12th day after exposure, the victim's throat breaks out and they start experiencing flu like symptoms. As soon as a person's throat breaks out, they are contagious. At early onset of symptoms, the victim develops a very unique facial characteristic that can only be described as hyper concentration and the mind is extremely clear. 72 hours after onset of symptoms, pustules develop, with the greatest concentration on the face. The pustules are extremely hard and dry. 24 hours later, the excruciating pain begins as the pustules start to break open and the agony intensifies as this literally begins to remove the skin from the body.

    The mechanism by which small pox kills its victims isn't clearly known, but physicians believe it is most probably related to shock induced by the agony and the diminishment of the immune system. What is known is that 1 in 3 will die and of the survivors, roughly half will be horribly scarred and permanently debilitated to some degree from the disease.

    The other thing that cannot be known with any certainty is the multiplier or the number of people each infected person will in turn infect. Estimates are from 3 to 30. Let's assume a multiplier of 10 and merely 1000 people initially infected. In 36 days, there are 1,000,000 infected people. Simplistic? Yes, but I think suitable for example.

    The genetic structure of the small pox virus is easily manipulated and a strain for which the current vaccines would be useless would be fairly easy to create. Both North Korea and Iraq both have the technical ability to do this.

    This madman has also been buying large amounts of atropine from Turkey. Atropine is the drug of choice for treating persons exposed to Sarin. As insane as this man is, I cannot for a moment think that he believes it's going to be us using it on the Iraqis.

    The only question in my mind is why we haven't moved to remove these toys from his playpen sooner?

    Edit: I contructed the symptoms timetable from memory and I may have missed something...my memory isn't what it used to be.
  2. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    Ken...it really doesn't matter if anyone here is listening to those crazy hippie protesters....I'm awfully damned sure Iraq wasn't listening. Just as I'm sure he wasn't listening to you when you opposed funding 'this'...oh my bad, I actually don't remember any protests regarding Iraq's amassing of small pox, sarin or the gassing of the Kurds.
  3. -Ken

    -Ken Guest

    No, I want to know how weapons we developed (top secret) got into
    their hands.

    While I realize some came from the breakup of the SU, the idea that
    this stuff made it into unstable countries' hands shows some pretty
    poor planning on everybody's part.

    These guys didn't just get smallpox at the local corner pharmacy.

    I was the guy protesting the R&D money
    that was being spent on developing this stuff.

    Sarin wasn't invented in Iraq. Neither was the technology used
    to create their military. To my knowledge the Iraqis don't build
    aircraft or sophisticated weapons of their own.

    We don't let children play with loaded
    guns. What the heck were we thinking?
  4. Sierra Mike

    Sierra Mike The Dude Abides Staff Member

    I'm not so sure the US handed that stuff over to the Iraqis. Remember, there was a cult in Japan that developed Sarin, and we can be pretty sure we didn't give that to them, either. :)

    I think a lot of this material came from the SU. Maybe Perry would be willing to risk retribution to confirm this?

  5. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    Aside from the FSU, Iraq had another opportunity to obtain the small pox virii. In 1973, there was a fairly substaintial outbreak of Small Pox in the Iraq and neighboring countries. Pretty simple task to get a sample and culture it from there.
  6. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    Coot, I thought I mentioned this in this thread, but looking over it, I guess I didn't.

    Just wanted to thank you for a great write up on the Small Pox situation.
  7. Perry Stroika

    Perry Stroika Member

    When you see pictures of an old rusty warehouse and some 15 year old guarding it do not believe it's some super secret facility that has nuclear weapons.

    Nuclear, and bio chemicals are guarded more than you will see from the western press which is not even allowed to come near the true facilities, even if they knew where this was.
  8. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    It's looking more and more like a member of the scientific community in the FSU did in fact provide Iraq with the small pox virus.
    Story Here
  9. mikeky

    mikeky Member

    So what the hell was he thinking? Did it for money? I'm guessing somehow this collection was not found or destroyed during the previous efforts.
  10. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    Sorry to resurrect an old thread but this is very relevant:

    More than 80 hospitals from every region in the USA, including leading teaching hospitals and large, urban public hospitals, are forgoing the vaccinations. The dissenters are a fraction of the 3,000 hospitals recruited by state health officials to vaccinate doctors, nurses and other hospital staff members who are most likely to care for smallpox patients.

    But their numbers are growing as doctors and administrators at hospitals around the USA are concluding that the known health risks from the vaccine, which can cause illness and even death, outweigh the unquantifiable risks of smallpox being used as a terrorist weapon.

    The refusal to vaccinate raises questions about the president's plan just as the first phase is expected to begin this week. Some health care experts and government officials fear that any reluctance to participate in the first phase could lessen the willingness of others to participate in the second phase -- and undermine the administration's goal of eliminating smallpox as a viable option for terrorists.

    From <a href="http://personal.news.yahoo.com/us/news/ratings/getavgrate.html?locale=us&prop=news&rateid=usatoday/20030121/4794957&type=T&cat=676&ncid=">USA Today</a>
  11. mikepd

    mikepd Veteran Member

    Ethics, I could not get the link to work, got a blank page with what look like a vote tally on top.

    In any event, all vaccinations with live material and/or preservatives run the risk of allergic reactions some of which can be quite serious. I had the smallpox vaccine as a child. I have a reaction mark to show for it. There is a risk/benefit trade off in all things medical. What happens if the worst case scenario comes to pass? We are unprepared to deal with the general adult population much less our children or elderly. The sick or otherwise immune compromised, will probably be just written off. Let's just keep sticking our heads in the sand because as we all know, if we ignore a difficult problem then it will just go away. Right?
  12. Coot

    Coot Passed Away January 7, 2010

    The Link is farked
  13. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

  14. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer

    Some people will wait until more people are vaccinated as is usual in the military and those that participate in the voluntary program. I would be interested in the results of the side effects that would corespond to the national average.

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