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Mairjuana: Leads to Drugs After all?

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by ethics, Jan 23, 2003.

  1. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    A joint US-Australian study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association of 311 twins has found that those who use marijuana before the age of 17 are 2-5 times more likely to use other illegal drugs and develop dependencies. Even after controlling for other known risk factors this link persisted. The researchers say the link between early marijuana use and later use of other drugs is unclear.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2679471.stm
     
  2. Coriolis

    Coriolis Bob's your uncle

    But, on the flip side:

    <i>Cannabis 'not linked to harder drugs'

    Cannabis use does not lead to experimentation with harder drugs, researchers say.

    US researchers said it does not act as a "gateway" drug, and that measures to curb cannabis use does not have a knock-on effect on the use of harder drugs.

    Instead, they say teenagers begin using cannabis, or marijuana, simply because it is the most available drug.</i>

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2538065.stm
     
  3. Domh

    Domh Full Member

    A "joint" study, hunh ethics?

    I think your makin it all up.

    ;)
     
  4. IamZed

    IamZed ...

    I want to say this about that. The concept of one drug leading to another is true in reality, but false for the reasons we are given.. It is true that drugs lead to other drugs. I did them all and I know who introduced them to me. A professional dealer.
    The deal is that no one ever caught me buying beer and attempted to convince me to drink wine instead.
    It is the supplier that causes the upward linkage. Drug dealers want to sell their most profitable ware. You are coerced by incompetent salesman that never learned to make the same profit on weed.
    If pot were legal, I seriously doubt the casher at the 7-11 would tempt me to try to convert me to heroin as I purchased it. They dont attempt to make me buy wine.
    The world is abandoning us on our war on drugs. It is like a war against waves. It didnt work for Caligula but we will throw billions more at it yet.
     
  5. Stiofan

    Stiofan Master Po

    What can't be forgotten is that some people have a definite additive personality. I have a friend who used to drink heavily. Now he doesn't, but he can't get enough caffeine now. Another friend is off the booze, but he uses chewing tobacco and can't shake it. Another friend went through various drugs, smoking, binge eating, one after the other.

    I don't seem to have this problem. I smoke a pipe and cigars. I think I had about ten cigars last year and smoke my pipe maybe once a month at most. I drink, but never rarely more than one per day and I have gone weeks without touching it. Now I've tried just tried just about everything, but never really continued any drugs - just didn't interest me like it did some of my friends, a few of which still smoke pot regularly to this day, 25 years after starting.
     
  6. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    Arre these friends who have smoked it for 25 years still productive members of society. I mean from what everybody says they must be laying around saying, "Hey man, is this cool?"

    I know they are a threat to our way of life but do they hold jobs, have kids, and care for them?

    The question is facetious, Mr. Agent Man, but that is the propaganda that the shrillest voices put out. Time to put this boogie bear away.
     
  7. Stiofan

    Stiofan Master Po

    Of course you're right, they are productive, but goes to show the fallacy of studies like these. My point is that a certain number of people are going to be addicted to something, even if pot wasn't available.
     
  8. Steve

    Steve Is that it, then?

    Perhaps the problem lies in defining "more likely". I smoked pot in high school and enjoyed a couple of other substances, too, although I stayed away from coke and heroin.

    So, according to the study, I'm 2 to 5 times "more likely" to develop dependencies. Yet, I did not. So, what number, multiplied by an integer between 2 and 5, results in zero?

    Trick question, of course.

    What the hell does "more likely" mean?
     
  9. IamZed

    IamZed ...

    I smoke pot. To the most miniscule amount possible, but I do do it. at special events and such. I am however totally addicted to tobacco. I do have things to work on.
     
  10. Advocat

    Advocat Viral Memes a Speciality Staff Member

    Fascinating. I wonder if the study had been conducted slightly differently that it would have shown that those twins who used alcohol before age 17 would go on to develop addictions to marijuana and harder drugs when older?

    Of course, no one wants to point a finger at alcohol as causing a problem now, do they? ;)
     
  11. Copzilla

    Copzilla dangerous animal Staff Member

    I think the study will inevitably show that, every time, for one reason.

    People who use drugs, will use drugs. Why not try something harder? The personality of the person is more likely to be experimental at the detriment of their own health, in spite of the educational attempt to steer them away from that, why wouldn't other illegal substances be attempted?
     
  12. midranger4

    midranger4 Banned

    Hi..my name is Midranger and I'm a *pothead*

    I eat lots of cheetos, love milkshakes, and find SpongeBob SquarePants absolutely hilarious when I'm buzzed.

    Sorry...but that's it folks.

    I tend to think people that partake in smoking pot in my age group are equally as boring.

    Adults like myself are the rule...not the exception that these findings would like people to believe.
     
  13. Violet1966

    Violet1966 Stand and Deliver Staff Member

    LOL oh I'm not falling into a trap I hope. I don't smoke pot anymore but did for more than half my life. I happen to be surrounded by people who smoke pot even though I don't do it anymore and that's fine. They like getting high and do it as often as they want fine. I was the same and am not one to judge how much they partake. I grew up with people who smoked pot. I have friends who are going no where who smoke it and have friends who are somewhere and still smoke it. One thing I do know is that I wasn't alone in one thing, everyone I ever knew who smoked pot has tried other drugs. (Even my once geeky and totally jocked out brother started smoking pot in high school and tried other things after that. I never thought it would ever happen because I believed he was an alien up to that point.)

    Now that doesn't mean that they all went on to use other drugs, but once you're daring enough to catch a buzz from weed, and know how good it makes you feel, you really don't get too scared to try something else if it's supposed to make you feel good too. And that's the facts. Flame all you want. It won't hurt me one bit I promise. I have not given up toking all together, am just on a break in my life due to my having two more children who are still young and I have to be 100% alert to deal with them. I cannot condemn those who smoke pot but I think you're fooling yourself if you don't see those around you and except the fact that if you do something like smoke pot, well snorting a line of coke don't look too scary. My opinion and based on the world that's been around me my whole life. All age groups and class types. Religion don't matter in this one and neither does financial wealth or poverty. If it feels good, people are gonna try it.

    Oh and as far as the addiction aspect goes, well no one's an addict till they think they are ;)
     
  14. rowd

    rowd Spark Maker

    Drug abuse or misuse will always be with us.
    I had a good friend who got involved in coke and then crack. He totally screwed up his life. One day I was talking to his mother. I was trying to explain to her the nature of addiction and she asked me what was the primary cause. I thought for a moment and told her :

    <i>"I don't think men will ever be free of the need to alter their consciousness. As long as there is pain in the human condition.....the need to escape that pain in what ever form it takes, will always lead for some to take mind altering chemicals."</i>

    I believe that still.
     
  15. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    That's a decent explanation.

    Perhaps the answer to why do some people have addictive personalities, the answer would be the amount of pain in their lives and the ability to decipher and numb it without any outside chemical help.
     
  16. ditch

    ditch Downunder Member

    As I was unable to open either of the two BBC links I went to the local Sydney story here.

    The use of twins and the significance to the findings isn't well explained. Non identical twins are no more alike genetically than siblings of different ages. Only some of the twins used were identical twins
    The study's findings would have been more legitimate if only identical twins were used. If that was the case then the relative influence of genetic and environmental factors would have been clearer. By including non identical twins in the study as well seems to only confuse the issue. The point of only using same sex twins is also not explained and would also been of interest.

    Like a lot of findings of behavioural studies, the commonly held opinions were supported. That is, the use of softer drugs precedes the use of harder drugs. Beer precedes wine precedes brandy is the usual course of events without the next step necessarily being taken. Even given the difficult environmental factors some people experience only some will resort to drug abuse. What determines this difference would also be worth hearing more about.
     
  17. ditch

    ditch Downunder Member

    Posted twice.:)
     
  18. muddly

    muddly Guest

    Well, I smoked marijuana. Then I graduated to amphetamines, LSD, mescaline, mushrooms, heroin, tranquilizers and various prescription drugs. You could say they were all stepping stones, or you could say drugs and I were like instant soulmates and that's just the order they happened to become available ;) Typical bored spoiled suburban girl :) I'm much better now :)

    If I had not had an opportunity to try marijuana first, I would have skipped straight to the amphetamines. And since I tried alcohol long before I got to marijuana, I gotta wonder why this study isn't about booze as the gateway drug. Or caffeine or nicotine. Because it's marijuana that is teetering between legal and illegal?

    If one identical twin smokes pot, then takes other drugs, and the other twin doesn't smoke pot, and doesn't take other drugs... you could say the pot caused the further drug use, or you could ask yourself what factor caused one identical twin to try marijana and the other not in the first place. Either an environmental stimulus, or a personality difference not explained by genetics, no? So could that unknown factor explain the subsequent use, as well as the first?.

    Marijuana was the mildest, least damaging drug I ever did, (and I'm including prescription drugs I had a valid prescription for) and had the least impact on my life, much less so than both nicotine and alcohol.

    I mention that because I suspect this study will factor into the mumblings about decriminalization and legalization, and maybe that's too bad. I suppose it's reasonable to know as much about it as we can before having an opinion (or a vote) on that. But whether drugs will affect your life has far, FAR more to do with your life than with the drugs. Whether you will go from pot to something else is all about you, not the pot. I know many people who smoke pot and have for a long time, who would not touch other drugs.
     
  19. ditch

    ditch Downunder Member

    Yes I agree there Muddly. Lots of people wont touch anything other than pot and others will try anything thats available. That's what prompts theses studies, to try and determine the causal factors of why some do and some don't migrate from the soft to the hard.
    I took a similar path to you a long time ago but a lot of those I smoked with didn't go anywhere from pot. Some did but the majority didn't. I think in my case it was a personality thing not harsh environmental factors making me look for an escape. Nothing of the sort, I just wanted to get some kicks.
    A somewhat similar thing with alcohol. I had an unrestained approach to drinking for a few years but I think there a lot more that do that than experiment with drugs. Plenty who drink way too much and accuse anyone who smokes a joint a year as a druggie. Its a complex issue, difficult to explain why who does what and what for.
     

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