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Lower the voting age?

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by Techie2000, Nov 4, 2002.

  1. Techie2000

    Techie2000 The crowd would sing:

    stevent: Yeah i think your right and will have to agree with you. A small test (10 questions about some basic stuff) would be best.
     
  2. Sunriser13

    Sunriser13 Knee Deep in Paradise

    You'd probably cut out over 50% of the ones who now vote... :haha:
     
  3. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    Testing was used by southerners after the Civil War to keep blacks from voting. Your 10 question test would keep many from voting but why can't a person vote for what they believe without understanding the whole system. Joe Dumass might understand that candidate A will better his public housing and should not he be allowed to vote?

    I totally understand and want to agree that some intelligence should be a requirement for voting, parenting, etc. The problem, however, is determing who decides and how they determine intelligence. There are those who think anybody who believes in a God is stupid. There are those who think nothing is worth fighting for and we know they are stupid. :=). So, although the concept is good, the implementation could start the next Civil War.
     
  4. drslash

    drslash It's all about the beer

    That is a very good post. I may not agree with all of it but you definitely express yourself very well.

    If it were possible, I would vote to give you the vote and buy you a :beer:
     
  5. RRedline

    RRedline Veteran MMember

    It is a well-known fact that inexperienced drivers are more likely to cause an accident. It is discrimination, but with a good and legal reason. The only thing I don't agree with is lowering rates for married people. Insurance companies should not be allowed to use that. They aren't allowed to charge men more than women for auto rates here in PA, so why are they allowed to charge me more because I am not married?

    In general, it is the insurance companies who get screwed over - not the insureds. You have no idea just how often fraudulent claims are made and how difficult and expensive it is to fight them in court. Unethical lawyers are destroying this country more than any other group, in my opinion.
     
  6. RRedline

    RRedline Veteran MMember

    I agree. It is an unfortunate side effect of our voting system that allows stupid people to have a say in our government. It is also unfortunate that so many politicians aim their campaigns at those very same people using scare tactics and trash talk against their opponents.

    Rather than using some sort of intelligence test, how about a very basic test to weed out people who know nothing about the people on the ballot? For example, use a multiple choice test asking voters to identify which party each candidate belongs to and where they stand on a few major issues? That woudl be more fair than an IQ test. It doesn't say anywhere in the Constitution that only intelligent people should be permitted to vote. It would be equally unfair to allow only people who prove they can bench press their own weight. And who would set the standards anyway?
     
  7. Steve

    Steve Is that it, then?

    ShinyTop, if Joe Dumass doesn't realize that the public housing will be improved, but all the food stamps will disappear (as an example), then, yeah, he shouldn't be allowed to vote. Awareness of implications is important. We should all be voting to improve the greater good of the herd, not just our little corner of the pasture. That's one reason why people opposed to school taxes (I don't have children, why should I pay?!?!) really piss me off!

    I know testing has been abused in the past. No need for us to repeat that mistake!

    I honestly can't even tell you what form I would like to see the test take on. It would require some serious thought to make sure it's unbiased, succinct, and fair. I do believe the concept is a good one, I just don't know how to implement it.
     
  8. drslash

    drslash It's all about the beer

    The concept is bad. It will never be implemented.
     
  9. Techie2000

    Techie2000 The crowd would sing:

    Stevent: With the new electronic voting machines in Florida, which are reported to be very successful (no glitches at all) (EDIT: I'm talking about the touchscreen ones. If I understand the TV correctly, the "scantron" ones have been having a few glitches here and there...) the test could be taken right before you cast your ballet on one of these electronic machines. The biggest problem is what questions to ask the people? One wrong or hard question and the ACLU will be up your rear faster than you can say recount if they weren't already for such an idea...

    RRedline: Yes it does make sense for inexperienced drivers, however what if I become proficiant at driving as quickly and well as I become proficiant with computers? Should I still have to pay? What about the married 35 year old female who kept her license, but never bothered to drive because they prefer public transportation?
     
  10. Steve

    Steve Is that it, then?

    In Canada, in order to claim prizes in contests, you need to be able to pass a test. At least, it used to be that way.

    Maybe something simple, some 8th-grade level math and language questions. I dunno, it would take a lot of thought to come up with the "right" questions.
     
  11. HaYwIrE

    HaYwIrE Banned

    • You haven't been denied the right to do anything. You just haven't earned it yet. Get some experience under your belt first. Become truly informed. Then you can vote. ;)
    • Nobody said you're stupid. But you probablt don't know a fraction of what you think you do. You have to live it to know it, and you haven't lived yet.
      [/list=a]Don't be in such a hurry to grow up. It's not as cool as it looks at your young age. Besides, the way the education system brain washes you kids nowadays with "Political Correctness" and Liberal lies, if they allowed you to vote, Republicans wouldn't stand a chance. LOL! :)
     
  12. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    How about the same questions used for immigrants on their citizen entry interview?


    Something like, what 3 branches comprise the US government? Or
    Name 3 Bill of Rights
    Or
    Who was Linda Lovelace?

    Sorry man, just couldn't resist. :happy:
     
  13. Steve

    Steve Is that it, then?

    You're bad! :)
     
  14. HaYwIrE

    HaYwIrE Banned

    Wasn't she... like... a senator out west back in the 70's and 80's? I know it was about that time I become interested in politics, and I remember having a deeply emotional respect for her. :huh:
     
  15. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    But in all seriousness, why do newly naturalized citizens know more about the functions of the US than the native born?

    Why NOT apply that same test to decide who can and can not vote. Perhaps throw in a few current events questions in there.
     
  16. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    Techie, I agree with the extra money for insurance for younger drivers. But my contention has always been, or at least since my insurance went up so much with my children, was that after two years of no tickets or accidents they should be considered as competent as others for insurance purposes. After all, the insurance companies say they use tables but they should only be counted when there is nothing else to go on.

    But the evils that insurance companies do is another topic.
     
  17. Techie2000

    Techie2000 The crowd would sing:

    ethics: The reason is quite simple. We integrate learning all those things with school. We are taught it in social studies class, tested on it, and if we fail we just do good on our other tests and can still get a B. We then move on to math or science, or spanish. There are little consequences for failing the test, and everyone who is born here already is a US citizen so there is no motivation to bother to learn. However if you had them take the test somewhere besides a classroom, not during school time, and threatened to strip them of their citizenship at the age of 18 or force them to stay back in school until they could pass the test and advance to the next grade, or something, then I'm sure a lot more people would know a lot more about our government. The naturlized citizens know more because they want to become part of our country, and know that if they don't know their stuff, then they lose their chance...
     
  18. RRedline

    RRedline Veteran MMember

    I understand that the insurance business is not necessarily "fair," but companies must be consistent with regards to how they treat people. For example, my premium is surcharged for driving a high performance vehicle. I don't drive around town laying rubber and racing high school kids on the strip, so why am I being surcharged? Just because my car has the POTENTIAL to go fast? I can name a handful of luxury cars that could easily keep up with my car. For example, the Infinity Q40(or is it 45?) puts out well over 300 HP! Why is that vehicle not classified as high performance? It all comes down to the simple fact that many(not all) people buy cars like mine simply so they can go fast.

    If you are unhappy with you insurance, look elsewhere. Many companies use different classification systems altogether. For example, my motorcyle would cost me around $3,000 per year to insure through Nationwide because they know that many people drive recklessly on bikes like mine. It's less than $400 with State Farm because their rates are based on engine size alone. It's a fascinating business, but they are not the monsters that people make them out to be.

    Trust me, they are not as bad as the lawyers who fight against them every day in court. Medical malpractice insurance is so high here in Pennsylvania, that many doctors are leaving. In fact, it is a big political issue. Insurance companies are forced to pay off people who really don't deserve a dime, and that is the biggest reason for high insurance. Stop the fraud and lower the payouts, and your rates will be cut in half or even better. And keep in mind that insurance is a very competitive business. It's not like anyone has a monopoly on it.
     
  19. jamming

    jamming Banned

    Insurance Companies, base their rates on profiling, everytime you limit their ability to profile you increase the costs for everyone.
     
  20. HaYwIrE

    HaYwIrE Banned

    Life isn't fair, and companies cannot treat each and every customer the same as the last/next. They can endeavor to do their best at it, but this is just a simple fact of life. The sooner people realize that and stop whining about "<i>my civil right this</i>" and "<i>my civil right that</i>", the better off this world'll be.

    Kids think they are mature... in fact <b>are</b> perhaps more mature than kids were 20 years ago. But the simple fact remains that kids don't know shit when it comes to the types of things that we are discussing here. Period. [​IMG]
     

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