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Do you believe in Karma?

Discussion in 'Issues Around the World' started by bruzzes, Dec 19, 2002.

  1. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer

    In Buddhist teaching, the law of karma, says only this: `for every event that occurs, there will follow another event whose existence was caused by the first, and this second event will be pleasant or unpleasant according as its cause was skillful or unskillful.' A skillful event is one that is not accompanied by craving, resistance or delusions; an unskillful event is one that is accompanied by any one of those things. (Events are not skillful in themselves, but are so called only in virtue of the mental events that occur with them.)
    Therefore, the law of Karma teaches that responsibility for unskillful actions is born by the person who commits them.
    =============================================
    From the Bagavad Gita comes the golden rule, do unto others as you would have them do to you.


    This is a common concept integrated by the Eastern Religions.
    Somehow it has become an important term used in our Western thought.

    I am curious as to what this term means to each individual and is it an important aspect in their actions.

    Again karma can mean whatever your interpretation of it is. Do not feel compelled to stick to it's strict formal meaning.
     
  2. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    My understanding of karma has been "What goes around, comes around." If you behave honestly and with compassion you will be rewarded. If you do nothing but hate and screw everybody around you suffer for it. And I would like to believe in it.
     
  3. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    Without Karma, there is no life. Without life, there is no death.
     
  4. LissaKay

    LissaKay Oh ... Really???

    I believe in Karma, absolutely. I have seen it fulfilled too many times not to believe. Too many times, people have screwed me over only to suffer some crisis or disaster not too long after. I also believe that trying to make Karma happen, i.e., seeking revenge, disrupts the flow of events and therefor, the intended recipient of Karmactic consequences is spared their true justice. The Universe may seem chaotic and random, but there is balance.

    I also believe in reverse Karma ... that certain events come to pass in order to set the stage and make conditions right for future events to happen. This has happened to me in too many ways, too many times and too obviously to not be some part of the Master Plan for my life.

    But dammit ... it is TIME for the GOOD Karma to start flowing THIS way!
     
  5. Paladin

    Paladin Have Gun -- Will Travel

    ...
    Mind ye threefold law ye should,
    three times bad and three times good
    ...

    Call it Karma. Call it the Threefold Law. Call it the Golden Rule. Whatever you want to call it, it has been observed to exist.
     
  6. midranger4

    midranger4 Banned

    Karma = What goes around....comes around.


    I absolutely believe this to be true and have seen it in action a couple times in my life.

    I kind of think of karma as a force that keeps the universe in balance.

    Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Sometimes these reactions are immediate and cleary visible. Other times the reactions are subtle and no so quick to transpire....but in the end it all balances out.
     
  7. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer

    Karma is defined by it's action.

    Often people expect a swift proof of it's existence.
    It is easily dismissed if one does not see or experience it's result.

    I firmly believe in this law.
    It brings stability in a chaotic world.

    It is ironic that I see it as comforting perhaps as Einstein viewed Newtonian Physics. It is a balance as DemiGoddess says.

    When I wonder when it's results will appear, I am often reminded of the phrase "in God's time, not mine".

    I too feel exactly as you do DemiGoddess. After practicing most of my life doing the best I can to help others I sometimes bemoan the fact that I am not reaping the rewards of my efforts. The realization that if one expects a reward than the act itself is neutralized.

    I am reminded of the Publican and the Pharisee of my Catholic upbringing. The Pharisee shouts to the Lord of his giving to him to show off in front of others. That attention becomes his reward. Temporal at best. The publican gives in silence and in secret. His reward becomes one of the treasures of heaven.

    Expect nothing and the law will fullfill itself.
     
  8. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    People often wonder about the timing, which is probably the most mysterious of all aspects of Karma.

    Instant karma is not the best Karma, folks, sometimes you need the right set up, and some time for it to simmer.

    I also believe that you don't need to get yourself involved in order to see it work. Most people "wish" bad karma on to others that did them wrong. I believe that's the wrong thing to do and where conventional religion comes to play about turning the other cheek and letting the force work itself in the way it should.
     
  9. Violet1966

    Violet1966 Stand and Deliver Staff Member

    Like Demi, I've seen karma in action. I strongly believe in karma. I live in fear thinking that if i do something wrong to someone, that that wrong will come back at me even worse. So yeah...what comes around goes around. I've seen it many many times.
     
  10. jamming

    jamming Banned

    Personally, I don't believe in a big cosmic pool of Karma, but I think there are consequences that are to particular behavior. Christianity puts it differently in that sin is seperation from God. To me you naturally attract people to which you display similar behaviors with. When I see some who says I only meet idiots in this world it makes me wonder what kind of attitude are they putting out. If I am courteous I usually get courtesy in return and if I present attitude I get attitude in return. There are of course exceptions to that. This is one of the things that I have discovered about discussing things with other religious traditions is that we each have ways of expressing similar real world observations. Whether mine is better than another is not a thing I consider, I try to find the question which we are both seeking answers to. Some ways I like Karma explanation better and there may be more truth in it, if I consider that God "knows the number of hairs upon" my head in his involvment in my life.
     
  11. ethics

    ethics Pomp-Dumpster Staff Member

    The big three religions do not believe in karma, but they do believe and preach repercussions va hell and heaven.

    To me, it's way too late and allows a bad person not to learn his/her mistakes until after their death.
     
  12. jamming

    jamming Banned

    Actually, Heaven and Hell are the end point of repercussions there are other points in the Bible where repercussions are talk about in more immediate ways. Paul's Epistles to the Churches when he talks about certain behaviors occuring at the Church.
     
  13. Aria

    Aria All shall love me&despair

    I believe in the Threefold Law, it's shown itself to be true many times in my life.
     
  14. wapu

    wapu Veteran Member

    My wife calls it Karma, but I prefer to think of it as a natural balance in nature. Nature is neutral and just as it abhors a vacuum it also abhors a "swell", if you will. I believe this to be true in my life and I approach situations with this in mind. I look back on the events in my life that I remember in a negative way and I can see the positive events that create that balance. My belief in this balance almost makes me fear an over abundance of good fortune. I can't help but wonder if it is just the upside of a previous down?

    To that end, I also think the balance is not two dimensional. There is a third dimension that allows for the fulcrum to be raised and lowered as well. That is what I strive to do, raise the fulcrum so that the up is higher and the low does not go quite so low.

    I see people like my cousins and uncles who have spent their whole lives trying to cheat the balance and all they have accomplished is to lower the fulcrum to the point that the highest high they can reach is still lower than what a reasonable person would consider good fortune.

    wapu
     
  15. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer

    The aspect of the fulcrum is that it changes as one grows.
    It never remains in the same spot. The balance is still there on both sides but the position will change.
     
  16. -Ken

    -Ken Guest

    With complete acknowledgement that we create (to a certain extent) our own realities, I believe in the concept of Karma, as defined by the "what goes around, comes around" statement.

    I neither wish bad on people who I believe have done me wrong nor wait for it to happen. Because I do not see the payback being metered out does not mean it isn't happening.

    I believe there are times where we pay for transgressions in advance as we will all make them, no matter how careful we are.

    I try to not wish for things to change because sometimes they will. This is usually when I realize how good the times I wanted to change really were.

    The true reward is not in material things, which can certainly influence our emotional well being but rather the feeling of elation and peace of mind our consciousness feels.


    There is a story, told to me long ago, which was attributed to the Native American culture by the person who told me. Please forgive my memory for being what it is but I will retell it as best I can remember.

    The Magic Pouch.

    To each person, when they are born receive a pouch. This pouch contains a magic powder which will be used on those special times where great harm might have befallen them but narrowly misses them. We have all had those occasions where we dodge the bullet.

    When we are young, we run through life carelessly using this precious gift as though it was endless. As we get older some of us realize the richness of this gift and become more careful There are some who seem to rip a hole in this pouch and allow it to leak out at an accelerated rate. As I watch my child run at breakneck speeds down the stairs, I am reminded how careless most youth is with this precious gift.

    As a teenager, I survived several automobile accidents that should have killed everyone in the car. Once, the tow truck driver, who responded to the scene, asked me if the bodies had been removed from the car. I had to explain to him, I was the body and he replied, Bullshit, nobody survived that crash.

    I fear my pouch is running low. Perhaps, that is why I try to do a little bit of good, every chance I can. I dont know if the pouch refills through these actions but it cant hurt to try!
     
  17. Misu

    Misu Hey, I saw that.

    I TOTALLY believe in Karma. I'm a very observant person, and I've seen with my own eyes what happens when one does things with a 'polluted heart', that is, with bad intentions. Karma is a bitch, a true equalizer.

    Editted to add this: I've also observed when people do things that are 'good', but for all the wrong reasons, that good things don't happen to them naturally. This makes for very frustrated people. I truly believe that if you do things expecting something in return, you're just setting yourself up for a HUGE dissappointment, as your intentions weren't purely for the good of it.

    I had this conversation with my husband last night, ironically. We exchanged gifts with some people last night, some friends of ours, and before we went out, my husband tells me "Misu, be prepared to not get any gifts back, I don't think these guys bought you anything". I'm like, dude, I don't CARE - I just want to see their faces when they open up the gifts we got them. We go, we exchange gifts, had fun.

    Back at home, my husband is all upset that only 1 of his friends bought him anything - and even at those gifts, he was telling me he knew his friend had gone out and bought them last second because he (my hubby) had hinted that we had spent X amount of money on his gifts... I was like, 'Sweety, did you think maybe they can't afford gifts for you? They're your friends, you spend loads of time with them, and whenever you do, you have FUN. Real fun - that's the best gift you can get from anyone." Husband is still sad, and was telling me he isn't going to buy anyone presents next year. I told him, if he buys things expecting things back, it's not going to happen.

    And it's true. You just set yourself up for dissappointment. So just do things for the pleasure of doing them - that in and of itself is the reason why I do most of what I do, because I ENJOY the act of giving gifts or doing favors for people. I enjoy what I get out of it, the feeling of helpfulness and when it comes to gifts, I like seeing people's expressions when they open up my gifts - things they never expected me to know about them because they don't realize how observant I am of them. That to me is the best part.

    So to me, Karma is a lot like exchanging gifts - I do it because I enjoy it, I give presents to particular people because I love to. Not because of what I expect in return - and I think I lead a pretty happy life. I wasn't always a happy person, but I wasn't this way back then, either. The fact I'm not that person any more is enough for me. Karma's paid me back really well.
     
  18. Alf

    Alf New Member

    I wasn't that dissapointed, I expected it. Not because they couldn't afford it, but because they didn't expect to do anything together for Christmas. Even at that, one of the gifts was an extra I bought for someone I didn't get anything for. So there!

    I was just dissapointed that we had run out of $$ and couldn't do much for the Holidays and I wasn't able to get Misu anything... still haven't gotten her anything... Alf = Bad Husband. 8)

    -Alf (Ok that was enough. Nice site! Yay my first post!)
     
  19. ShinyTop

    ShinyTop I know what is right or wrong!

    OMG, Misu, you had better start behaving yourself. I gotta admit I am glad my wife does not care for socializing on the web.
     
  20. bruzzes

    bruzzes Truthslayer

    You got that right Shiney! I cannot get my wife to join me on this site. I am secretly grateful. Talk about instant Karma, I would be at the bad end of it should she see how open and honest I am.

    That has always been a sore point between us.
    I am open, honest, friendly and courteous to a fault. I love people with a passion, particularly other races and creeds. I hunger for knowledge and seek out all viewpoints.

    My wife on the other hand is extremely private, who's fear of friendship and people almost reach a phobic stage. She exists only for her family and had stated after our marriage that her family is more important than her marriage to me. It was and is a bitter pill to swallow. Having a severe dysfunctional family, their travails often interfere adversely in our private lives. I have resigned myself to the acceptance of my fate. My wife often calls me a martyr and not lovingly so.

    It is sometimes difficult to adjust my manner, from my gregarious self, to one of submission. However I have managed it quite well.

    Should my wife read this post, I would be in deep do do!
    One important fact, before anyone gets the wrong idea, I love my wife and would not change my fate for another. We are all put into positions in which to grow. Negative situations are created, whether by fate or our own Karma, to teach us forbearance. A persons character can only be enriched by experiencing both the good and bad of life...

    If my wife should join this site, then perhaps the personal sharing I freely give would find no release.

    Besides, she may discover all the secret affairs I am having with all the wives of the male members on this site.:):):)
     

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