Martin Shooting in Florida

A pretty good balanced summary one stop shop as of today for a summary clearly written. Not perfect. But good. Adds some good circumstantial information. It misses one major point. I wonder who will notice or figure it out?

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/05/1...ad-bloody-nose-after-shooting-trayvon-martin/

This NYT article has some details I haven't seen elsewhere, including that Zim's car wasn't checked by police and was moved before they saw it. The close-up of Zim's head posted earlier shows some bumps, I think, I can believe he was getting hit and likely more than once. The question for me is, how strong was Martin at the time, how much oxygen did he have and how much adrenaline? The crime shows are often saying they can tell if a body ran out of oxygen, I expect that's possible to detect. How far did Martin run when he ran?
A TV video shows Martin at the convenience store, maybe leaning on the counter, maybe tired from pot or something else in his system. Adrenaline could cancel some of that, maybe not all, and it might affect a fight-or-flight decision. What would the case be if Zim didn't strike first but called out threats? I haven't heard anyone say there was any such thing, there seems to have been no attempt at communication at all between Martin and Zimmerman. If I were attempting to avoid detection by someone and that person was in silent pursuit, I would interpret that as agression, SYG law or otherwise. Is there any interpretation of SYG that takes that into account?
One story said Zimmerman was returning to his car when Martin "confronted" him. Was that an ambush, then, without spoken words? Although the posted version of SYG says the first hit is the agressor, I think every unarmed action hero who ever took down a bunch of armed bad guys was acting in self defense, not committing murder. We don't have to put all those movie heroes on trial, do we? If Martin did perhaps hide behind a bush and then jump Zimmerman, could it show that Martin was scared or would it only prove the shooting was justified?

Both the prosecution and defense in the Trayvon Martin case want some evidence kept private until trial. All for good reason!
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/05/2...want-evidence-private-in-trayvon-martin-case/

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...120522_1_witnesses-change-shooting-fdle-agent

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/23/george-zimmerman-sanford-police_n_1541250.html

As the country knows Zimmerman is back in jail as the judge revoked his bond with the court believing that Zimmerman lied about his financial status at his bond hearing.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/04/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=us_c2

Here today from CNN is an excellent one-stop start web page on much of the facts and opinions directly and indirectly linked to this case.

The center article of the webpage focuses on the details about the facts relevant to Zimmerman’s return to jail. The story also has clearly labels with key links relevant to other issues or events in this case.

Then bracketing the article are other numerous but clearly labeled links or images to facts and details so far revealed. All here on one page—well over a dozen links. A good single source web page!

Oops! The sainted wife of that law and order crusader George Zimmerman has been arrested and charged with perjury!

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/

George due to certain circumstances will likely dodge the charge of perjury.

I'm sure the judge who will alone rule any claim Zimmerman might make on any stand your ground is not exactly being steered to a strong sense of confidence in Zimmerman's credibility on the claim if he makes it. And on that single issue by itself if asserted by Zimmerman the judge will to a large degree weigh the credibility of any statements or claims by Zimmerman. Remember any claim of stand your ground by is totally different from a criminal self-defense for the charges currently filed. A whole separate game.

Meanwhile all of the witnesses but one claiming any knowledge of the actual confrontation between Zimmerman and Martin whether seeing or hearing something have changed their stories. But heck that is yesterday's news so it probably isn't well known.

Actually you are being kind with your drop your word comment. I convoluted the answer badly especially with the unintended one extra word--"by." Don't ask me where it came from. If I knew I would tell you.

Zimmerman of course is charged with second degree murder. Unless a plea bargain is reached it will go to trial. There Zimmerman is projected to assert he is not guilty by reason of the defense of "self defense." The jury will decide his fate after the prosecution and defense rests.

However, separate from that as I understand the Florida "Stand your ground" statute form early on in the case Zimmerman can claim to the court, (the judge) in advance of the trial that the circumstances of the incident would qualify Zimmerman for the immunity from prosecution for his act because the circumstance were such that Zimmerman is protected by the "Stand your ground" law. In such a case the judge makes the call. Hence my comment about the credibility part of the information in the judge's opinion about the facts offered presented by Zimmerman/attorney in his claim for protection under the "stand your ground." When there are no or only "weak" or circumstantial witnesses the judge relies heavily upon what he perceives as the credibility of the person making the claim of stand your ground in the story the person tells. Hence, Zimmerman's deception about the money hurts his chances for a stand your ground ruling in his favor.

If the judge declines granting him protection under the stand your ground law then Zimmerman has to take his case to the jury, where he has all ready been charged. There he offers up his criminal defense of self-defense which is totally unrelated to stand your ground.

I'm not sure if the jury even has an option of making stand your ground as an option for them to decide or choose. My impression is they do not but, again, I'm not sure about that.

One thing for sure the media and many of the talking heads including the legal talking heads really demonstrated a conflicting understanding of the "stand your ground" law and how and when or under what circumstances it applies as well as how it is separate from the criminal "self-defense" statute after being charged.

From the beginning when this first made national headlines, I have sensed a behind the scenes game being played. I have no real idea what it is, but I suspect it has something to do with the "stand your ground" laws, ie, someone (group) wants to put them in a bad light and chose this case as a starting point.

When the incident first happened, it is obvious law enforcement (police, DA, etal) put no great significance to the event. Shortly after, when some 'national' figures became interested, the heat was turned up. As time went on bits of evidence came to light, there was a lot of speculation and several different versions of the event. Witnesses have changed/altered statements, some have been discredited, some have added 'new' pieces. The latest, we have Mrs. Z charged with purjury.

This is becoming a real sideshow and as I stated earlier, I sense some deeper currents than a potential trail for manslaughter.

Post test to see if there is a problem on my end or the server or server software end.

The judge has ordered the release for public access records pertaining to George Zimmerman and the Martin shooting that normally would not be available.

In most cases it is best for the defense in a criminal trial to delay or stretch out as much time as possible between the alleged crime and the trial of the accused.

That may be a good strategy too for Zimmerman. But the waters are a bit murky on that issue here and it may be to Zimmerman's benefit to go to trial as quickly as possible. (That tactic was used very successfully in the OJ case by the defense.)

I don't know what is best for Zimmerman at this point but it certainly is my impression that the broad public opinion is going become over time less and less favorable toward Zimmerman and or his character and credibility separate from the merits or facts of the shooting, both those known and those not.

Fair or not and accurate or not I would expect that ongoing media information will on balance be unfavorable to Zimmerman. Not only because of the bias of the LSM but because of their ignorance.

For instance I haven't yet seen anywhere where the media has figured out that according to medical records Zimmerman was based upon his prescription medications was taking the drug that when used as a street drug or unprescribed drug is known as "speed" on the days leading up to and on the night of the shooting. Zimmerman had a prescription for Adderall. It appears that the media hasn't caught on to what exactly Adderall is. Zimmerman was also taking a benzodiazepine drug in order to sleep at night. Benzodiazapine drugs include drugs such as Valium or Xanax. Zimmerman was taking a drug related to those. So circumstantial evidence suggests he appears to take speed by day and then needs to take the "benzo" or downer at night to sleep. All of that may mean something or it may be nothing but it certainly is a serious issue that needs to be clarified. The big question is if he was taking those drugs how is that going to be played at trial? It likely would be introduced in the opening argument of the prosecution.

Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee who ducked for cover and went on leave shortly after releasing George Zimmerman is being fired.

http://www.baynews9.com/content/new...icles/cfn/2012/6/20/sanford_police_chief.html

ZIMMERMAN BOND HEARING TODAY.

I just watched the real-time live feed of the bond hearing for George Zimmerman. The court is now in recess to consider the evidence. It was unclear how long the recess it to be from watching the hearing. Defense has requested the same bond as before and the people request no bond be granted.

Zimmerman’s attorney and the attorney for the people are both articulate and comfortable arguing their points. However, they are polar opposites in style or demeanor. Zimmerman’s attorney is soft spoken and speaks slowly in a relaxed but measured conversational style. He uses emotion gently and measures it carefully. He maintains neutral body language. His counterpart is more the traditional hard-hitting “emotional” style.

Both styles are effective. How they are perceived in terms of effectiveness lies with the state of mind or personality of the listeners. That in the long run will be the jury.

Zimmerman’s attorney wanted the court to allow Zimmerman to take the stand to address the court about the misrepresentation by his wife under oath on how much money they had at the last bond hearing. But he asked the court that since Zimmerman would take the stand for the sole purpose of addressing the court on the issue of the money that he not be subject to cross-examination.

The court basically interrupted him on that argument and said if Zimmerman takes the stand he is subject to cross-examination. Not surprisingly opposing counsel strongly concurred.

Then both counsels took the opportunity to argue about the facts and merits of the confrontation and outcome of the encounter between Martin and Zimmerman.

The judge politely listened. Then basically said all that stuff was very interesting but this hearing was just about the bond request and the issue of the deception to the court about the monetary deception.

To the point of the deception the defense argued that Zimmerman was just confused and afraid at the bond hearing and that is why he did not speak up or indicate that his wife was lying on the stand about their money situation. Defense argued that Zimmerman should have spoken up but emphasized he failed to do so not because he was part of any conspiracy to deceive the court but because of his fearful and confused state of mind. According to defense counsel Zimmerman’s mental state was caused in essence from overnight going from a man cleared by the police to having a second-degree murder charge and incarceration dropped on him.

IMO based upon the judge’s body language, demeanor and from what his comments were it appears to me that he has all ready made up his mind. I would speculate he pretty much had it made up before the hearing. The recess is just a chance for him to compose what he exactly is going to say in stating his ruling factoring in the comments from both sides.

Since the end of this is up to a year away if the judge denies bond or makes it so high it cannot be met Zimmerman will be incarcerated until the end. That means from the defense’s point of view that if he is acquitted he will end being a man spending a year locked up for a crime he did not commit. (Per a hypothetical not guilty finding.)

It appears the judge in the case is taking his job very seriously. Surprisingly he has yet to rule on whether or not to grant bond to Zimmerman since the last hearing on Friday. Zimmerman’s attorney submitted a substantial amount of information or evidence on why the judge should grant bond. Naturally, the prosecution disagrees.

IMO the judge should grant bond. There are really only two relevant issues to whether or not bond should be granted. Is Zimmerman a flight risk and in the court’s opinion does he present a threat to the public. The answer seems based upon all the facts, no. That finding is corroborated by the length of time that Zimmerman was out on bond previously, his conduct while out on bond, and the fact that he misrepresented to the court about his financial situation is irrelevant to the threat or flight issue.

If Zimmerman is granted bond then the next question is will his attorney request a pre-trial hearing to determine if under Florida’s stand your ground law Zimmerman should be granted immunity from prosecution based upon the evidence submitted at the hearing. If such a hearing is held and the judge rules in favor of Zimmerman than he walks as a free man and there is no trial.

However, if there is a hearing, and there may not be as the defense may not request one, you can just about bet the farm that Zimmerman will testify. There is no way IMO that his counsel wants him subject to cross-examination. And there just isn’t anyway Zimmerman is going to get a favorable ruling on the stand your ground motion if he doesn’t testify.

Next will be the trial if there is no stand your ground hearing or there is one and the judge doesn’t rule in Zimmerman’s favor. At trial Zimmerman will claim the affirmative defense of self-defense.

Based at this moment I would say that if it goes to trial and a verdict is reached the most likely outcome will be Zimmerman will be found guilty, more likely of manslaughter than of second degree murder all though the latter is possible. Acquittal too is a possible reasonable outcome but IMO it is the least likely outcome if a verdict is reached.

A plea bargain is definitely possible in this case. That possibility increases if the judge rules that Zimmerman not be granted bond.

Finally if it goes to trial that is probably quite a ways down the road. The defense likely wants passions to lessen with the passing of time.

He got his bond set at $1,000,000. (Rightfully granted IMO.) However, the restrictions on him are more stringent than before.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/07/05/zimmerman-bail-set-at-1m-in-trayvon-martin-case/

ADDENDUM: Forgot to mention that in increasing Zimmerman's bond seven-fold the judge said as part of the reason for increasing the bond was the judge believed that while Zimmerman was out on the previous bond he was getting ready to flee the country.

The judges words, not mine. Likelihood of attempted plea bargain increases.

George Zimmerman’s attorney has filed a motion requesting the current judge recuse himself for conduct that is alleged to show bias against Zimmerman.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/07/13/george-zimmerman-asks-for-new-judge-again/

Of the two main arguments in the motion one is solid and one is weak.

The strong argument is the court’s pronouncement in granting the second bond that the court felt that Zimmerman was preparing to flee the country while he was out on the first bond that was granted him. However, the judge offered no evidence linked to or part of the statement to explain the court’s reasoning.
The weak argument is that the court’s statement that Zimmerman flaunted the system is weak in when taken in context of when and how that statement was made.

The statement was made at the second bond hearing. I watched that hearing via live video feed as it happen. The context was Zimmerman’s attorney argued to the court words to the effect that he and Zimmerman acknowledged that Zimmerman’s action regarding the hiding or concealment of money and making misrepresentation to the court on that issue were wrong and disrespectful to the judge. In the middle of that lengthy argument as counsel repetitively referred to Zimmerman’s inappropriate actions and misrepresentation to the court or to the judge. Then the judge decisively cut him off. The judge made clear that Zimmerman’s actions were not considered as anything negative against the judge or the court but was in effect Zimmerman doing something wrong or thumbing his nose at the system---not the judge.

As for the claim that Zimmerman cannot get a fair hearing from this judge either at trial or in a stand your ground hearing is interesting, as I don’t expect the defense to request a stand your ground hearing. IMO Zimmerman has no chance of getting a favorable ruling. Also, at such a hearing in Florida I do not recall if Zimmerman would have to take the stand in such a hearing. If he would then I would speculate the chance lessens that a stand your ground hearing will be sought. There is no way IMO the defense wants Zimmerman to be cross-examined at such a hearing.

In a meeting with the girls parents Zimmerman allegedly didn’t deny the allegations.

If she is about 27 now and Zimmerman is 28 does this allegation raise some questions?

Even if true how is it relevant to the charges now against Zimmerman?

The girl’s claims she is only bring the charges now because Zimmerman is for the first time in a place where he can’t get at her.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Latest...ousin-accuses-him-of-sexual-molestation-video