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Domh
02-16-2004, 08:06 AM
Not mine, but an interesting read with some flaws... and some good points.

"Liberals claim President Bush shouldn't have started this war. They complain
about his prosecution of it. One liberal recently even claimed that Bush was
the worst president in U.S. history.

We need to clear up one point: We didn't start the war on terror. Try to
remember, it was started by terrorists on 9/11.

Let's look at the "worst" president and mismanagement claims.

(1) FDR led us into World War II. Germany never attacked us: Japan did.

From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,500 per year.

(2) Truman finished that war and started one in Korea.

North Korea never attacked us. From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost, an
average of 18,333 per year.

(3) John F. Kennedy started the Vietnam conflict in 1962. Vietnam never
attacked us.

(4) Johnson turned Vietnam into a quagmire. Remember the "Gulf of Tonkin
incident" that never happened?

From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost, an average of 5,800 per year.

(5) Clinton went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent, Bosnia never
attacked us. He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three times
by Sudan and did nothing. Osama has attacked us on numerous occasions.

Compare the above with the two years since terrorists attacked us.

President Bush has liberated two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled
al-Qaida, put nuclear inspectors in Lybia, Iran and North Korea without
firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered at least 500,000 of
his own people. We've lost 600 soldiers, an average of 300 a year. Bush did
all this abroad while not allowing another terrorist attack at home.

Worst president in history? I don't think so."

bruzzes
02-16-2004, 08:38 PM
I'm shocked Dom!

Fiona
02-16-2004, 08:42 PM
I"m not! Good read! :thumbsup:

ShinyTop
02-16-2004, 08:47 PM
Come on, you pick one topic to decide an issue like this. I am speechless. I am sure it is only temporary but words escape me.

Colin
02-16-2004, 09:02 PM
I agree with your ultimate conclusion that GW Bush is far from the worst president in US history, but I will take slight issue with a couple points:

(1) FDR led us into World War II. Germany never attacked us: Japan did.

FDR did lead us into WW2, and rightfully so! He correctly foresaw that Nazi Germany was the greatest menace to world peace (and America’s long-term security) and Hitler’s defeat was essential to prevent the establishment of a fascist empire on continental Europe… an empire that would surely expand across the globe if left unchecked.

It is not entirely true that Germany did not attack us before Pearl Harbor. Numerous American sailors were killed in German naval attacks on US supply convoys to Britain in the Atlantic prior to Pearl Harbor. Now, it is very true that we were officially neutral at the time – and sending ships loaded with contraband of war into war zones is not a very neutral act! But, again, I don’t fault FDR on this. He was doing all he could to keep Britain’s head above water until the US could find a reason to enter the war on her side. This reason was, ultimately, provided by Hitler himself. Even after Pearl Harbor FDR still didn’t have the muscle to declare war on Germany (Japan’s Axis partner), but Hitler relieved him of this problem by declaring war on the USA.

(2) Truman finished that war and started one in Korea.

Communist/Stalinist North Korea attacked our ally, the Republic of Korea (South Korea). This was clearly aggression by one state against another state (by the DPRK against the ROK) and thus had to be responded to. The Korean War was the first UN-backed war too.

ShinyTop
02-16-2004, 09:36 PM
While I agree that Bush is not the worst the criteria used by Dom above are certainly not the last word. Except for the very scary religious right flavor that Bush brings to the table, Johnson was much worst in just about every category that Bush is chasing, such as humongous deficit and unpaid for war that will cripple the economy. But Johnson knew he was not God's right hand and Bush does not know that. And Johnson pretty much stayed away from destroying the Bill of Rights. Warren Harding, US Grant and the beloved Carter certainly were huge screwups as Presidents.

ethics
02-16-2004, 09:46 PM
Awesome stuff, Domh... Quickly explains how people on the video tend not to know much about history.

Domh
02-16-2004, 09:50 PM
Oh theres alot of things the author misses.

They seem obsessed with which nations attacked us and which didnt.

Iraq didnt. They fit more into the Korea/Vietnam mold than the Germany mold.

I still think its an interesting read.

Coot
02-16-2004, 10:57 PM
Funny, from the title I would have sworn this was a thread about Millard Fillmore :)

Sir Joseph
02-16-2004, 11:10 PM
The comic strip character?

:)

Coot
02-16-2004, 11:11 PM
Well, the 13th President was comical enough :)

Sir Joseph
02-16-2004, 11:14 PM
He's around the place where most people end up skipping to Lincoln.

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